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by Messy Social Work
Welcome to the Messy Social Work podcast. The hosts are Richard Devine and Tim Fisher. Check out our website here: https://www.relationalactivism.com/
Latest Episodes
The most recent episodes — sign up to get AI-powered summaries of each one.
- 2 weeks ago56 min
Rich and Tim speak to Maddy McCormack (Social Worker) on the realities of Child Protection Social Work
In this episode, we speak with Maddy McCormack, a social worker early in her career, about the realities of stepping into practice with children and families. Maddy reflects on her route into the role, what day-to-day social work actually looks like, and what she’s had to learn beyond training to be effective in her first year. We explore how she builds relationships with young people and their families, especially in contexts of risk, conflict, and uncertainty. She speaks candidly about the ...
- 3 weeks ago1h 10m
Rich and Tim speak to Sharon Shoesmith about Baby P, blame and learning from tragedies
In this episode, we sit down with Sharon Shoesmith to revisit one of the most defining and contentious moments in modern child protection: the case of Baby P, and the national reaction that followed. Sharon reflects candidly on what it meant to become the focus of public anger—labelled, scrutinised, and ultimately removed from her role—despite leading a service that had been judged as “good” by Ofsted. We explore the personal toll of that experience and the powerful social and political...
- 4 weeks ago1h 22m
Rich and Tim introduce Systemic Ideas in Social Work with student Natasha Dube and author Liz Bosanquet
In this episode of the Messy Social Work podcast, we begin with a conversation with Natasha Dube, before Rich and Tim discuss Liz Bosanquet’s new book, Systemic Social Work Practice. The discussion explores how systemic ideas can move beyond theory and into everyday practice, helping practitioners think relationally about families, organisations and the wider systems shaping people’s lives. A conversation about curiosity, context, relationships and what systemic practice looks like in the rea...
- May 6, 202645 min
BONUS Episode: Rich and Tim Speak with Charlotte Spires on Time management, burnout and spiritual Pain (Part 2)
In this second bonus episode, Rich, Tim and Charlotte build directly on Part 1, turning their attention to the four remaining ideas from Rich’s blog on resilience in social work and exploring how these play out in practice. The conversation moves beyond individual productivity and into the ethical and emotional costs of working under sustained pressure. Drawing on Vikki Reynolds’ work, the episode explores burnout not as a personal failing, but as a response to spiritual pain, moral distress ...
- May 1, 20261h 0m
Rich and Tim discuss time management ideas that DEFINITELY & FINALLY allow you to get on top of your work
This episode explores time management as both a practical challenge and a lived experience in social work. Rich shares techniques such as Stephen Covey’s urgent and important quadrants, Cal Newport’s time blocking and the difference between deep and shallow work, while also being honest about how difficult these are to sustain in real practice. The conversation moves into presence, stress and pragmatism, recognising that social workers are often pulled between statutory timelines, emotional l...
- Apr 27, 202646 min
BONUS Episode: Rich and Tim discuss what Rich learned from 6 years of journaling (Part Two)
This bonus episode picks up where the previous conversation left off. Rich and Tim return to six years of journals to explore the next three themes that emerged — the ones that didn’t fit neatly, resolve cleanly, or offer easy lessons. They begin with work and purpose, tracing how Rich’s journals reveal a constant back‑and‑forth: ambition and exhaustion, pride and resentment, meaning and burnout. They talk about the pressure to have impact, the cost of carrying work into every corner of life,...
- Apr 24, 202659 min
Rich and Tim discuss what Rich learned from 6 years of journaling
In this episode, Rich and Tim sit down with six years of personal journals and ask a simple but uncomfortable question: what actually changed? They focus on the first three themes that stood out when Rich reread everything back. First, Rich reflects on the long arc of his mental health — how early journal entries framed exhaustion, irritability and low mood as problems of discipline, productivity, or personal failure, and how long it took before he had the language to name depression honestly...
- Apr 16, 202659 min
Rich and Tim speak to Psychotherapist, Jamie Crabb on suffering, care, and staying with what we don’t yet understand.
In this episode of Messy Social Work, Rich and Tim are joined by therapist and writer Jamie Crabb to explore his powerful article Care, and Being Seen in the Presence of the Enigmatic. Jamie reflects on what care really asks of us when things don’t make sense—when distress can’t be easily named, understood, or fixed. Drawing on his own experience of the care system, his therapeutic work, and psychoanalytic ideas, we talk about what it means to be “seen” when what is being communicated is embo...
About Messy Social Work
Welcome to the Messy Social Work podcast. The hosts are Richard Devine and Tim Fisher. Check out our website here: https://www.relationalactivism.com/
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